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  • OT - Killings at Fort Hood

    WASHINGTON (AFP) - Armed gunmen Thursday killed seven people and wounded at least 12 others in a bloody rampage at Fort Hood military base in Texas, US officials and media said.

    Both the Pentagon and local police confirmed to AFP that there had been a shooting, but could not give details on how many victims there were on the base in Killeen, in central Texas.


    President Barack Obama had been informed of the shooting, a White House official said.


    A suspect was in custody, Master Sergeant Tim Volkert at Fort Hood told AFP. "We're trying to confirm the exact numbers" of dead and wounded, he said.


    But a Killeen police department spokeswoman warned there were still suspects at large. "There has been a shooting at Fort Hood and all the suspects are not in custody at this time," she told AFP.


    "I know they have active shooters out there."


    She would not give any more details, but local and national media reported that seven people had been killed and 12 others wounded.


    MSNBC reported there were at least two shooters, with one in custody, adding there was speculation that there may be a third gunman.


    One of the shooters at large was believed to have a high-powered sniper rifle, and was holed up in a building surrounded by SWAT teams, MSNBC said.


    It was not immediately clear if it was an attack on the base, or whether the shootings were carried out by US soldiers.


    Local congressman John Carter confirmed there had been a shooting at Fort Hood, the nation's largest US military base whose troops have seen extensive tours of duty in Iraq.


    The gunfire had erupted ahead of a graduation ceremony in the soldier readiness center, Carter said, but could not confirm reports of injuries.


    "I had a man on the scene, who is my regional director and former chaplin at Fort Hood, waiting to go to a graduation ceremony when a soldier came running up to him saying, "sir, don't go over there. They are -- somebody is shooting over there," Carter told on MSNBC.


    "When the soldier ran by him, he saw the soldier didn't know it, but he was wounded. So, he went into the building and they stopped him, because he had been shot.


    "He heard small arms and some rifle fire while he was there and that he thought they had one person that they had caught but there may be more, he didn't know. He understood there was more than one, that was all he said."


    Fort Hood has been working to rehabilitate many soldiers suffering from post-traumatic stress syndrome, Carter added.


    A message on Fort Hood's website -- the headquarters of the Army 3rd Corps, the 4th Infantry Division and the 1st Cavalry Division -- said it was closed, but gave no further details. All those units have seen extensive duty in Iraq.


    "Effective immediately. Fort Hood is closed. Organizations/units are instructed to execute a 100 percent accountability of all personnel. This is not a Drill. It is an Emergency Situation," the website.

    Army personnel told a Fox news affiliate they were not sure if the victims were civilians or military personnel.

    Schools in the area were also on lockdown, MSNBC said.
    *************************************
    Each day I encounter stupid people I keep wondering... is today when I get my first assault charge??

  • #2
    Latest from AP is that 12 are dead and 31 wounded. A gunman, a Major and psychologist or psychiatrist, is dead and two other soldiers are in custody,

    The latest news and headlines from Yahoo News. Get breaking news stories and in-depth coverage with videos and photos.
    A generous and sadistic GM,
    Brandon Cope

    http://copeab.tripod.com

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    • #3
      Originally posted by copeab View Post
      Latest from AP is that 12 are dead and 31 wounded. A gunman, a Major and psychologist or psychiatrist, is dead and two other soldiers are in custody,

      http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091105/..._hood_shooting
      Got the same information. I didn't know he was a Major. However, it was stated on our news that he did it all by himself and was of Palestinian descent. I actually saw MD on his registration form but didn't know he was psychologist or psychiatrist. Really sorry for those killed and I share the feeling expressed by Obama (at least what we heard of it).

      A less serious note in the middle of this drama: French often refer to Psychologists as Psycho and that says it all.

      Actually, it seems that he is alive and that he is a psychiatrist.
      Last edited by Mohoender; 11-05-2009, 11:59 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        tragic

        sorry about the tragedy befallen the US again .

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by headquarters View Post
          sorry about the tragedy befallen the US again .
          Thanks. The fun just never seems to stop.
          “We’re not innovating. We’re selectively imitating.” June Bernstein, Acting President of the University of Arizona in Tucson, November 15, 1998.

          Comment


          • #6
            My thoughts go out to everyone else who is waiting to see if someone they know is a casualty, and esecially to the families and friends who know already. Truly a damnable shame...

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Mohoender View Post
              A less serious note in the middle of this drama: French often refer to Psychologists as Psycho and that says it all.
              There was a saying over here in Australia when I was still in the army - "who psychs the psychs"
              Not one of them that I met (and there were quite a few!) could possibly be described as completely sane....
              Last edited by Legbreaker; 11-09-2009, 05:31 AM.
              If it moves, shoot it, if not push it, if it still doesn't move, use explosives.

              Nothing happens in isolation - it's called "the butterfly effect"

              Mors ante pudorem

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              • #8
                One problem is he is islamic, and per the news reports and even some former collegues he was anti American and deployment and sympathetic to the terrorists and their cause or at least their actions.
                "God bless America, the land of the free, but only so long as it remains the home of the brave."

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                • #9
                  Yes it sounds as if he should of been throwing up red flags that people ignored.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by jester View Post
                    One problem is he is islamic, and per the news reports and even some former collegues he was anti American and deployment and sympathetic to the terrorists and their cause or at least their actions.

                    Being anti-American is obviously a problem. If he's anti-deployment, he's in the wrong line of work. If he's sympathetic to the terrorists, he's living in the wrong nation. Being Muslim can't be counted as a problem--not in a First Amendment nation.

                    Webstral
                    “We’re not innovating. We’re selectively imitating.” June Bernstein, Acting President of the University of Arizona in Tucson, November 15, 1998.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      French reports are not going the way you describe.

                      They were saying that he was pro-american but discriminated by fellow troopers for being muslim and palestinian (sadly I can buy that).

                      They were also saying that he was growing more and more tired from listening what soldiers coming from Iraq and Afghanistan had to say. Kind of getting battle fatigue before even getting to the battlefield. I'm not a specialist but I think it is not unheard of from military psychiatrist.

                      It seems also that the various authorities deny any connection with terrorists. Sorry but I hardly admit that US authorities are still (if they ever were) stupid enough not to monitor someone of his rank and potential influence on soldiers who would have connections or sympathy with terrorists (especially after 9/11).

                      Of course, I'm not trying to find him excuses, but the idea that the guy was islamic, terrorist lover and anti-american..., and still holding the position he had in the US Army is unacceptable. Moreover, if fellow soldiers and officers had known about that and not done anything about it what are they: traitors If not traitors, they should be considered his accomplice and prosecuted consequently. I agree that I'm a little extreme in this but if I was one of his victim's father/brother and you were explaining me that you knew but didn't do shit, I'm not sure of what I would do. Such an idea is outrageous to me.

                      For my part, they sound more like school kids who had done something mean and try to run away from their responsibility.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Mohoender View Post
                        French reports are not going the way you describe.

                        They were saying that he was pro-american but discriminated by fellow troopers for being muslim and palestinian (sadly I can buy that).

                        They were also saying that he was growing more and more tired from listening what soldiers coming from Iraq and Afghanistan had to say. Kind of getting battle fatigue before even getting to the battlefield. I'm not a specialist but I think it is not unheard of from military psychiatrist.

                        It seems also that the various authorities deny any connection with terrorists. Sorry but I hardly admit that US authorities are still (if they ever were) stupid enough not to monitor someone of his rank and potential influence on soldiers who would have connections or sympathy with terrorists (especially after 9/11).

                        Of course, I'm not trying to find him excuses, but the idea that the guy was islamic, terrorist lover and anti-american..., and still holding the position he had in the US Army is unacceptable. Moreover, if fellow soldiers and officers had known about that and not done anything about it what are they: traitors If not traitors, they should be considered his accomplice and prosecuted consequently. I agree that I'm a little extreme in this but if I was one of his victim's father/brother and you were explaining me that you knew but didn't do shit, I'm not sure of what I would do. Such an idea is outrageous to me.

                        For my part, they sound more like school kids who had done something mean and try to run away from their responsibility.
                        Unfortunately, from what I've been able to find out you have the right scoop. Anti-Muslim discrimination has been growing in the military since 9/11 -- and I worry that it might get worse now. I worked with Muslims here and there in the Army, and they're no less American than the rest of us. Yes, the shooter must get a court-martial if he survives (it's looking like he might; he's here in San Antonio at Brooke AMC right now, BTW, along with several of the victims), but his actions have nothing to do with other Muslims. It's same as if he were a Christian and mentally-ill and started shooting people.

                        Since he appears to have given plenty of signs that he was unstable, and they seem to have been glossed over, I also think a top-to-bottom investigation of his chain of command and possibly a RIFT is in order.

                        It makes you wonder: How many other time bombs are in the military, pushed way too far by how hard we're pushing our troops
                        I'm guided by the beauty of our weapons...First We Take Manhattan, Jennifer Warnes

                        Entirely too much T2K stuff here: www.pmulcahy.com

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Webstral View Post
                          Being anti-American is obviously a problem. If he's anti-deployment, he's in the wrong line of work. If he's sympathetic to the terrorists, he's living in the wrong nation. Being Muslim can't be counted as a problem--not in a First Amendment nation.

                          Webstral
                          By itsself no not an issue, but with all of the stuff put together then yes it could be an issue.

                          As for what Mo said about commands knowing his comments and attituides. Me thinks it is probably retribution as the military is good at that sending folks they dislike to unpleasant jobs. And did they know but did nothing, well that is also common in the military especialy among the officer corps. No one wants to speak upyou never rock the boat.


                          Passing the buck transfering him to another command and making him someone else's problem is also often.
                          "God bless America, the land of the free, but only so long as it remains the home of the brave."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by jester View Post
                            Me thinks it is probably retribution as the military is good at that sending folks they dislike to unpleasant jobs. And did they know but did nothing, well that is also common in the military especialy among the officer corps. No one wants to speak upyou never rock the boat.


                            Passing the buck transfering him to another command and making him someone else's problem is also often.
                            Sage observations. Few get promoted by making waves. No one wants bad news on his Officer Evaluation Report. It's a shame that the inevitable outcome of a desire to avoid being seen as a troublemaker is a disaster like this one.

                            Originally posted by jester View Post
                            By itsself no not an issue, but with all of the stuff put together then yes it could be an issue.
                            We can't allow the exercise of Constitutional rights to be part of a formula by which we identify problems. Anti-American sentiments and other problematic behaviors must be taken by themselves and not factored in with faith. When we start suspecting Americans of crimes based on their faith or using faith as a multiplier to justify suspicions, we undermine the very principles which set us apart from the people we're fighting.

                            Webstral
                            “We’re not innovating. We’re selectively imitating.” June Bernstein, Acting President of the University of Arizona in Tucson, November 15, 1998.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Webstral View Post
                              Sage observations. Few get promoted by making waves. No one wants bad news on his Officer Evaluation Report. It's a shame that the inevitable outcome of a desire to avoid being seen as a troublemaker is a disaster like this one.
                              Ah, yes; no officer (or NCO) wants to be the "Atlas Man." (Do OERs and NCOERs still use that little diagram) But I've seen that happen too many times -- promote someone because he's a good schmoozer but otherwise a royal pain in the ass. If you promote him, you can get him reassigned outside your unit! It's really a lazy and stupid way to solve a problem with a soldier, and it gets used way too often, particularly with problem senior NCOs and mid-to-high-level officers.

                              Ironically, it's also used to get rid of another type of "problem" soldier" -- the one that sees problems and immediately starts working to fix them -- successfully. It's the sort of thing that makes his superiors pissed because he's exposing unit problems that his superiors were glossing over, ignoring, or actively trying to hide -- and it also makes them look bad because they couldn't fix the problems. A stupid and lazy senior NCO or officer will get rid of that guy because he "makes us look bad." A smart one will use that guy as his troubleshooter and go-to guy.
                              I'm guided by the beauty of our weapons...First We Take Manhattan, Jennifer Warnes

                              Entirely too much T2K stuff here: www.pmulcahy.com

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