Operation Omega and MILGOV

[kalos72]

RDF Sourcebook as well as Howling Wilderness both note troops moving to the Middle East as well as Norfolk being a major MILGOV enclave.

Now since there were like 10 ships MAX according to canon's version of Operation Omega, I guess a fully functioning port doesn't do much good after all. Granted I dont follow canon much but its still published at least...

Those are thermal effects, overpressure would indicate only window/light building damage at the Naval port itself, although the area would be a shambles at least based on the fire damage and such I would think.

[Legbreaker]

Now since there were like 10 ships MAX according to canon's version...

Why do you say that and what is it based on

[kalos72]

Ok I am going off what the original Operation Omega details implied. I dont believe there were any SOLID number given to limit this though.

I dont want to argue the navies line again, I read that thread, it wasnt purdy. :P

[kato13]

Why do you say that and what is it based on

Yeah I agree, I had always assume at least 50-100 ships or varying sizes. Maybe 10 that require a really deep port, but not ten total.

[kalos72]

Either way, once that oil tanker is empty, those ships are sitting reminders of what they DONT have. FUEL!

A military port either way isnt very important I dont think...

[Targan]

FYI What a 1M nuke bomb will do to Norfolk and the port facilities.

I'm happy to be corrected but from memory wasn't Norfolk only targeted with one nuclear warhead, and that malfunctioned/mis-targeted and detonated in the water somewhere out in Chesapeake Bay I'm pretty sure that the port facilities in and around Norfolk were damaged by the resulting tsunami, not by nuclear blast.

[kalos72]

I know Mayport had a 'near miss" but I haven't ready anything bout Norfolk being in the same boat. I could be wrong though...

[Legbreaker]

50,000 people on just 10 ships means a LOT of very close "friendships" developing! Even if you could find 10 ships each capable of holding an average of 5,000 people there's not a lot of space left for the necessities of life such as food, water, oxygen, etc...

I believe it's also mentioned in Going Home that even though the general perception was there wasn't enough space for everyone, there was plenty of room for all.

The RMS Queen Mary II is unable to carry enough fresh water to cater for it's passengers and crews needs for the relatively short hop across the Atlantic today. It is equipped with several desalination plants to make the crossing possible without everyone dying of thirst halfway.

So, it's not just space for people and their possessions which needs to be taken into acount, but their needs to remain alive along the way and, hopefully, for a period after debarkation.

[kalos72]

Either way...

A large Naval port to support a Navy with no fuel might not be such a concern. While feeding that Navy is more pressing at this stage.

[Legbreaker]

While there might not be much fuel, there should be enough to keep one of the more important vessels going for a while. It's doubtful they'd go very far, but would be a useful reserve force "just in case".

[kalos72]

Your missing the discussion point Leg. We are talking about how important a demolished Norfolk Naval Yard would be to the Enclave compared to moving to an area where they can feed themselves.

Regardless of the size and specifics of a fleet, food would be top priority considering how many other port options would be available to them in the area.

[Legbreaker]

And a working ship wouldn't be important for communication, transport of food stuffs and evacuation
The remaing fuel may even be used to power a small fishing fleet - while it lasts.

[kalos72]

As an asset sure...where that asset is parked, doesn't matter at all.

[Legbreaker]

If it's to be useful it needs to be close. The condition of available facilites is therefore very important.

I've said it before - nothing happens in isolation.

[sglancy12]

I'm happy to be corrected but from memory wasn't Norfolk only targeted with one nuclear warhead, and that malfunctioned/mis-targeted and detonated in the water somewhere out in Chesapeake Bay I'm pretty sure that the port facilities in and around Norfolk were damaged by the resulting tsunami, not by nuclear blast.

Kalos72 is right. That's the Jacksonville near miss you're thinking about.

Why Norfolk I mean it was hit by a few nukes and the port a melted pile of sludge I would think a more minor port advantageous to the Milgov...

Well if we can have a whole scenario set in L'vov after it got plastered by a MIRV (Bear's Den) then Norfolk can be used as a Milgov enclave.

Cheyenne Mountain took a 3Mt groundburst and survived in operational condition. That's within the facilities anticipated tolerances though. The part we should be griping about is that the fallout didn't irradiate Colorado Springs enough to make it uninhabitable for the next few decades, and therefore impossible to function as the HQ of Milgov. We never complain about that... but maybe we should.

I mean, Omaha as CivGov HQ after Offut AFB takes a hit Maybe in my homebrew I'll move Milgov HQ to Denver and CivGov HQ to Lincoln NB or maybe Minneapolis-St. Paul MN.

Also there is no mention of the troops going to the Middle East or anywhere else... and once more the issue of fuel supplies rears its ugly head when the only fuel available is from a drifting tanker....

The first mention of troops deploying from Operation Omega to the middle east is in the timeline for The RDF Sourcebook. Kalos72 mentions Howling Wilderness but I don't remember that reference and I'm away from my books at the moment.

Where that asset (the surviving ships) is parked, doesn't matter at all.

Actually it matters a whole lot. The surviving fleet units must be anchored somewhere defensible so they don't fall into the wrong hands. They have to be anchored somewhere sheltered from storms and other natural hazards. They can't be left without crews in international waters or the French are just going to sail up, drop a prize crew aboard and rename it La Bonaparte and they'd be within their rights to do so. Perhaps Norfolk, as bad as it is, is literally the only port on the east coast that is

a) under Milgov control

b) large enough to handle the number of surviving ships.

c) is appropriately sheltered from the elements

d) has enough surviving facilities to even get one small dry dock working.

Remember, the bombs hit in November of 97. By Summer of 2000 there has been plenty of time for Milgov to spend resources getting some parts of the yard back in business.

We are talking about how important a demolished Norfolk Naval Yard would be to the Enclave compared to moving to an area where they can feed themselves.

Once the men are ashore, they can use their LPCs to relocate to other enclaves, like the Ft. Dix enclave. Or if discharged by MilGov they could hoof it to the CivGov enclave in Maryland and sign up there too. Or just be discharged and start legging it for home to see if any of their friends or family made it. They don't have to sit there and starve.

The surviving fleet units don't have that luxury.


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