Arming the Omega ships

[Legbreaker]

And I agree totally that it would be nothing bigger than 105mm guns and probably 30 -40 rounds per gun for enough ammo.

Of course that is completely contrary to canon, but hey, if that's the way you want to play it in your personal game world, have at it.

[Olefin]

actually its not contradictory to canon in any way. The vessels and if they were armed were not covered by anything in canon except to say that the John Hancock was there.

And mounting cannon and machine guns and bringing man portable SAM's on board to make defend the ships in no way contradicts canon. All the tanks, heavy vehicles, vehicle mounted AA systems, 155mm guns, etc.. still stay in Europe

If I said they tied down M1 tanks and SP M109's on the ships to defend them it would contradict canon - but I never said that.

As for the tanks getting to the RDF - that was a side comment about our earlier discussion and not in any way part of what might have been used to arm the ships so they got home in one piece.

And per canon they did get home in one piece.

[Legbreaker]

actually its not contradictory to canon in any way.

Try looking at the definition of "heavy equipment" then. I think you'll find under the notes for the M1113 at globalsecurity.org:

The expanded payload capacity of the vehicle led to it being used in a wide variety of roles where carrying heavy equipment was required.

Note the words "carrying" followed by "heavy equipment". Seems to me that if a Humvee can carry it (in addition to towing) it could be considered heavy equipment. Even if you discount items such as TOW launchers and the like, it would appear to me at least that a 105mm howitzer, 20mm PIVAD or 120mm mortar isn't exactly going to escape the "heavy" tag.

Tell you what, I'll look up the definitions for you.

The definition of the word "heavy" according to dictionary.com as a military noun is "a gun of great weight or large caliber."
A synonym for "heavy" is:
a. armed or equipped with large weapons, armour, etc
b. (of guns, etc) of a large and powerful type

The definition of "equipment from the same source is: "anything kept, furnished, or provided for a specific purpose."

Now shall we look at the definition of "heavy weapons"
dictionary.com "noun: large but transportable armament [syn: artillery]"
http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictiona.../heavy+weapon: Any weapon such as a howitzer, mortar, heavy machine gun, and recoilless rifle that is usually part of infantry equipment.
According to U.S. Army regulations 320-5 (AR 320-5) "heavy weapons" are all "weapons such as mortars, howitzers, guns, heavy machineguns and recoilless rifles which are usually part of infantry equipment."

It's worth mentioning that even 3.5" Bazookas, grenade launchers and rifle grenades are considered heavy weapons by the US military. It's therefore rather likely IMO that TOW's, Stingers, and other manportable missiles and rockets will also be classified as "heavy" and technically subject to the Omega restrictions.

Note that in civilian life, "heavy equipment" applies to earth moving machinery, cranes, and the like. Therefore you can bet any engineer units will be stripped of their gear as well.

So, it's fairly obvious to all intelligent beings that artillery pieces are not going to be included in the items allowed to be taken back to the US. It's equally obvious that your argument about canon simply does not stand up to scrutiny.

To summarise, feel free to do what you like in your own game, but please, please, please stop trying to claim it's canon, you're right and everyone else is wrong - it just pisses everyone off and makes you look like an idiot.


Now, to get back to the topic of the thread, I can't see anything wrong with GPMGs being set up on the troop vessels for local AA and defence against potential boarders. Might even see the odd shoulder fired missile or rocket, but anything heavier is very, very unlikely and unnecessary since the fleet is escorted by warships and there's no reason for anyone to attack it in the first place.