Beta C-Mags

[Mahatatain]

Does anyone know when Beta C-Mags (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta_c-mag) became available IRL as I'm trying to figure out whether they are feasible for a T2k game

I've seen a reference on Wiki that mentions "Coil Magazines" for 7.62x51mm weapons from the "early 1990's" and the H&K MG-36 was released in 1997 (I think) and that was designed to be used with the C-Mag (again, according to Wiki). It therefore sounds feasible to me that a rare 5.56x45mm C-Mag or two could exist in a T2k game but I'm not certain.

As you can see my information is not very reliable so I wondered if anyone knows much about the C-Mag and when it became available, both in terms of general supply to troops and, prior to that, as a rare item amongst special forces types.

Thanks for any information/help.

[Raellus]

My copy of Osprey's Panama 1989-1990 has a color plate (F3) of a USN SEAL carrying an Colt Carbine fitted with a Beta C-mag twin 100 round drum magazine. So, it looks like USSF had access to them no later than '89. In the T2KU, I reckon most NATO SF using compatible weapons would have access to such magazines.

[Mahatatain]

My copy of Osprey's Panama 1989-1990 has a color plate (F3) of a USN SEAL carrying an Colt Carbine fitted with a Beta C-mag twin 100 round drum magazine. So, it looks like USSF had access to them no later than '89. In the T2KU, I reckon most NATO SF using compatible weapons would have access to such magazines.

Thanks for the info Rae - that's a hell of a lot earlier than I thought was the case!

[StainlessSteelCynic]

The patent for the C-Mag was filed in April 1987
Here's a link to the patent document

http://www.google.com/patentsid=A6s0AAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q&f=false

According to this website, the US Army tested the C-Mag recently in Afghanistan and found it had problems. Typically these were jams and failures to accept the stated 100-rds into the mag.

http://www.defendamerica.mil/articles/jul2003/a072803b.html

[raketenjagdpanzer]

The soldier in the foreground on my 1.0 boxed set has an M16 sporting one.

[Mahatatain]

Thanks for the help.

The patent for the C-Mag was filed in April 1987
Here's a link to the patent document

http://www.google.com/patentsid=A6s0AAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q&f=false

According to this website, the US Army tested the C-Mag recently in Afghanistan and found it had problems. Typically these were jams and failures to accept the stated 100-rds into the mag.
http://www.defendamerica.mil/article.../a072803b.html

Thanks for the date.

From the research I've done I think that they are susceptible to breakage, particularly if dropped or bashed. They therefore sound like a good option but shouldn't be exclusively relied upon.

The soldier in the foreground on my 1.0 boxed set has an M16 sporting one.

I'd forgotten about that. Being picky though I don't think that that is a Beta C-Mag in the drawing as its got one drum not two. What other extended mags were available at the time Does anyone know

[raketenjagdpanzer]

Thanks for the help.


Thanks for the date.

From the research I've done I think that they are susceptible to breakage, particularly if dropped or bashed. They therefore sound like a good option but shouldn't be exclusively relied upon.


I'd forgotten about that. Being picky though I don't think that that is a Beta C-Mag in the drawing as its got one drum not two. What other extended mags were available at the time Does anyone know

Actually taking a closer look, it looks like a smaller version of the a drum magazine, the type of which the bad guys used in the North Hollywood bank robbery shootout.

[Rockwolf66]

The soldier in the foreground on my 1.0 boxed set has an M16 sporting one.

That's not a C-mag that's a Modified RPK drum magazine. I've heard of them for a Mini-14 and they carry about 90 rounds.

[LAW0306]

if 100 round mags worked then everyone would have one.

[Medic]

Some people have a fixation about huge magazines on their assault rifles. However, I can come up with several reasons why they are not a good idea.

First of all, with an undisciplined firing style, a large magazine tends to lead to the barrel heating up much more than it should, which can cause it to warp. This will lead to the weapon becoming less accurate at first and if not noticed, even barrel blockage.

Second thing is the magazine itself. The big magazines are often unreliable if filled to the maximum capacity and tend to be both bulky and get in the way when firing from prone position.

I talked with a Finnish Army weaponsmith once and he kept cursing, how (especially) the younger officers often dream about a 100-round magazine on an assault rifle instead of the standard issue 30-round one. Since Finnish Army has modified assault rifles with such magazines for use as auxilliary weapon for the NSV heavy machinegun (due to the fact, the 7.62x39mm has a smaller safety zone on the firing range than 12.7x108mm), some actually manage to obtain such a magazine from the armory and usually destroy an assault rifle testing it.

[ArmySGT.]

I think their place is in the Defense and if you have set up an ambush.

In each case your not moving around and probably not slamming yourself to the ground.

On foot patrol or in MOUT. No too heavy.

The early ones were fragile but, with plastics today durable enough.

[bobcat]

i have heard vastly differing accounts of the performance of these magazines. in my experience they're damned good for some applications(ie. when in a vehicle, ambush, or in a defensive position) i've not encountered the commonly cited jamming issues but with 12 magazines i didn't have a sufficient sample for an accurate test.

[Tegyrius]

I'm somewhat interested in Surefire's quad-stack 60-round AR magazines. The form factor seems a little more compact than that of a drum.

- C.

[Rockwolf66]

I'm somewhat interested in Surefire's quad-stack 60-round AR magazines. The form factor seems a little more compact than that of a drum.

- C.

I know of a guy who keep one in the "pistol" he keeps under his bed. I'll have to talk him into letting me try it out sometime.

[waiting4something]

The soldier in the foreground on my 1.0 boxed set has an M16 sporting one.

The magazine on the box cover is actually a drawing of a Firepower Inc. Firepower Assault Magazine. That drum always got me curious to what it was or if it was just something the artist dreamed up from a RPK drum. Then when I finally saw them on auctions I was like "that's it"! It was the one real thing I bought because of that box cover.