OT - No child deserves to die because of a coward.

[Cdnwolf]

Just for comparison... no one was killed in the china incident...

AND PLEASE LEAVE POLITICS OUT THIS THREAD OR I WILL REMOVE IT


BEIJING A man wielding a knife attacked students Friday at a school in central China, leaving 22 children and one adult injured, according to state-run media reports.


The attack occurred at the gate of an elementary school in the village of Chengping, in Henan Province. Police arrested the attacker, who they identified as local resident Min Yingjun, 36.



Children as young as six were among those hospitalized after the attack, suffering injuries including slashes to the ears and head.

An official at Guangshan Traditional Chinese Medicine Hospital, the local facility, told CBS News at least two students had been transferred to the larger city of Wuhan, not far from Chengping, for treatment. The editor of the local newspaper which first reported the story said none of the children had injuries severe enough to threaten their lives.

[headquarters]

Condolances

My condolances . for the tragedy that has befallen is a particularily harsh one as it is Aimed at innocent children.

What Raellus said. The pro anti gun debate has no Place at a time like this. There will be time for that eventually.

God I hate people who commits atrocities like these mass shootings.

[Legbreaker]

From what I understand of the situation, this is a psychiatric rather than gun control issue. A firearm is simply a tool, which can be used for either good or ill. In this case it appears to have gone well beyond ill and right past evil too.

[Targan]

Just so that all the non-US posters here are clear, what does "don't make it political" mean I'm guessing (from what I know of the social and political landscape of the US) that in this context "political" means any discussion touching on gun control. If that's the case then this thread should be locked or even deleted straight away. How can you have any discussion about a massacre involving firearms without that elephant in the room

I feel very, very sorry for the victims' families and for all Americans every time I see another one of these slaughters. It also seems to me to be an enormous tragedy that the power of certain lobbies in the US means that any meaningful discussion on how best to prevent such tragedies gets completely hamstrung right at the start. If the gun control issue is a huge no-no, what does that leave you with Collective soul-searching about the possible underlying social or cultural triggers for shooting massacres Or is that a bit too political as well And if so, what room does that leave for any discussion at all, other than expressions of condolances

[kato13]

There are things this thread can be used for, like remembering those who acted like the best humanity has to offer when chaos and tragedy were all around them.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/newtown-teacher-vicki-soto-remembered-article-1.1221004

[natehale1971]

From all that i've been reading and seeing... this guy killed his mother in her sleep, and then took her guns before he went on his shooting spree. it's so messed up. he went to the school his mother worked, forced his way in... and all i can say is that there were heroes in that school. The adults put themselves between that monster and those innocent babies. And they died doing it. Something any of us would have done, because it was the right thing to do. they loved those children so much. and love is why they did what they did.

i've also been reading about whats been happening in China. And it's been a series of attacks being made against kids, one of the assaults was a man with an axe going after kids.

this isn't an issue of what tools are used, but the underlying cause... is it just pure evil I don't know.. all i know is that evil is present where love no longer exists. But those whom died protecting those children had so much love they used their own bodies as shields, they got the kids to safety.

And that is something we need to focus on, and not on the monster that did it. We shouldn't be hearing his name every few seconds on the news. we should be hearing the names of the brave souls who sacrifced themselves to save those babies lives.

But what is really bothering me is that this is happening in other places, in other countries with vastly different cultral norms or ideals. And it's just so strange that it's happening in such a way that it's happening in vasty different areas.

And it leaves us all asking ourselves... how the hell did this happen

[LBraden]

I know I can be blunt in cases, and right now, I am not of the best mental situation for other reasons than this but:

I have heard of several attacks in China, of course with the media over there being so controlled I doubt we will ever fully know what happened.

As for this latest shooting in America, I am reminded of a quote that I can't totally attribute to said person, but it was reportedly someone asking the singer Marilyn Manson "If the two people who did Columbine were here today, what would you say to them" and he replied "nothing, I would sit and listen to them as no one else did", and honestly, it's a 2 part problem, and I have seen a reply on a reddit thread where someone said "The other main thing that caused this is the media, they push this to being "headline news" and the people who think of getting attention see this as the only way of doing it, because honestly, no one actually has listened to them when they asked for help".

I do not have facts, but I do recall that a few of these have been done by males who are under the age of 25, and in society today, males are suppose to be "strong" and "not show weakness" this is one of the attributes to causes of problems with people who are suffering mental illness such as depression and suicidal thoughts.

Honestly, I am sat here going though another serious bought of depression, and have, honestly thought of suicide, I know what a lot of these "monsters" are going though, I have been though the same earlier stages, but honestly, I found another way to get people to listen to my problems, and yes, I don't speak much here, but the teamspeak server I am on with friends know that I will have a bout where I just end up waffling on about stuff, even if they mute me, just having the ability to speak about it, helps a LOT, and that's what society needs, is allowing males with problems to speak to people and not get told to "suck it up" as we often do, even from those who should help us.

Now, sorry if I have pissed anyone off, but seriously, that is what was needed to be said in my opinion, and honestly, if you don't like it, well, there is that wonderful button on your PC and there is something called "outside".

[Targan]

I can relate to what you're going through, LBraden. I've been a manic-depressive all my adult life. You're absolutely right, having someone to talk to helps enormously for some people with mental illness. Others it does not. I would suggest that very few western countries have close to the levels of affordable mental health services they need.

[natehale1971]

I've dealt with depression, and my sister is going through it right now due to the injuries to her hip that has a faulty plate that has growned down the top of her femur. the mental health clinic she goes to is really good, and the price is very affordable. there are options out there, but it's as if it is only for those who know where to look. the asistance had really helped my sister... we just need to find a doctor willing to help with the faulty plate in her hip, since 90% of her problems are related to that pain. and the doctors are at a loss for what to do to help her. because our family is known for our metabolism being so out there that common meds just don't work, or in the worse cases does the exact oposite that they are suppose to be doing. Don't even get me started on the list of meds we're allergic too that most are able to rely upon, especially when it comes to over the counter pain meds that can be deadly to us.
and you're right about the media hype. it's getting to a point where it's turning my stomach that they are running with this so much that it's... it's really screwed up.

[natehale1971]

I just read this about the monster in question... and it's strange, and i'm looking into the medical condition they are saying this guy had. if it's true, the only thing that could have stopped this... would have been for him to have been committed to an institution that would have monitored and cared for him 24/7.



(TheBlaze/AP) " At Newtown High School, Adam Lanza had trouble relating to fellow students and teachers, but that was only part of his problem. He seemed not to feel physical or emotional pain in the same way as classmates.

Richard Novia, the school districts head of security until 2008, who also served as adviser for the school technology club, said Lanza clearly oehad some disabilities.

oeIf that boy wouldve burned himself, he would not have known it or felt it physically, Novia told The Associated Press in a phone interview. oeIt was my job to pay close attention to that.

Novia was responsible for monitoring students as they used soldering tools and other potentially dangerous electrical equipment.

He recalled meeting with school guidance counselors, administrators and with the boys mother, Nancy Lanza, to understand his problems and find ways to ensure his safety. But there were others crises only his mother could solve.

oeHe would have an episode, and shed have to return or come to the high school and deal with it, Novia said, describing how the young man would sometimes withdraw completely oefrom whatever he was supposed to be doing, whether it was sitting in class or reading a book.

Adam Lanza oecould take flight, which I think was the big issue, and it wasnt a rebellious or defiant thing, Novia said. oeIt was withdrawal.

Authorities on Saturday continued a wide-ranging investigation into the second-deadliest school shooting in U.S. history, trying to understand what led the young man to kill his mother in their home and then slaughter 26 children and adults at a Connecticut elementary school before taking his own life.

Back in their teenage years, Adam and his older brother, Ryan, were both members of the tech club, which offered students a chance to work on computers, videotape school events and produce public-access broadcasts.

It was popular among socially awkward students. But Adam, while clearly smart, had problems that went beyond a normal adolescent lack of social skills, Novia said.

oeYou had yourself a very scared young boy, who was very nervous around people he could trust or he refused to speak with, Novia said.

The club provided a setting for students to build lasting friendships. But while other members were acquainted with Adam, none was close to him.

oeHave you found his best friend Have you found a friend Novia asked. oeYoure not going to. He was a loner.

Adam was not physically bullied, although he may have been teased, Novia said.

The club gave the boy a place where he could be more at ease and indulge his interest in computers. His anxieties appeared to ease somewhat, but they never disappeared. When people approached him in the hallways, he would press himself against the wall or walk in a different direction, clutching tight to his black case.

oeThe behavior would be more like an 8-year-old who refuses to give up his teddy bear, Novia said. oeWhat you knew with Adam is it was a possession. It was not a possession to be put at risk.

Even so, Novia said, his primary concern was that Adam might become a target for abuse by his fellow students, not that he might become a threat.

oeSomewhere along in the last four years, there were significant changes that led to what has happened, Novia said. oeI could never have foreseen him doing that.

Jim McDade, who lives a few houses from where Nancy Lanza was slain, said his family became acquainted with the two brothers and their mother because their children were about the same ages and rode the school bus together.

oeThere was certainly no indication of anything unusual that lets you think that a kids going to do something like that, said McDade, who works in finance in New York. oeThere was nothing that would indicate anything going on behind the scenes that would lead to this horrible mess.

He recalled Adam Lanza as oea very bright kid.

The Associated Press has more, including interviews with Lanzas neighbors:

Olivia DeVivo, a student at the University of Connecticut, was in Adam Lanzas 10th grade English class.

oeHe was very different and very shy and didnt make an effort to interact with anybody, she said.

DeVivo said Lanza always carried a briefcase and wore his shirts buttoned up to the top button. She said he seemed bright but never really participated in class.

oeNow looking back, its kind of like `OK, he had all these signs, but you cant say every shy person would do something like this.

"

Associated Press writers Michael Melia and Jim Fitzgerald in Newtown, Conn., and Denise Lavoie in Stamford, Conn., contributed to this report.

[LBraden]

There are enough of those "buzzwords" that people like to use than the actual problem, that person has Autism, I would say "serious Aspergers Syndrome/ Light Autism", I have mild Aspergers myself.

Honestly ... that kid sounds like me before I got the help I needed, all he needed was that right person to be there for mental health before this happened, it's a sad day all around that this happens, and the real cause is pushed to the side because of those "gun control" people that say it's that fault, or it's game developers fault. rather than actually finding the REAL cause.

[Cdnwolf]

Interesting fact is nothing is mentioned of the father....

[mikeo80]

I know I have no answers.

Short of MASSIVE security at EVERY public event, there will always be someone who will find a way to use a weapon or a tool or a something to alieviate whatever demon that lives within.

I have been diagnosed with everything from depression to Asburgers to God knows what. I still function. I still have a sense of right and wrong. I own guns legally. I like to see myself as a moral person. DO I have demons Sure. DO I manage to keep them locked in some closet in my mind SO far so good. Have I been tempted Yep. Do I act on those temptations So far so good.

So to sum up. No answers except for myself. I know what and where my boundries are. I know that IF I am looking over the boundry, don't go near where the guns are kept. Do I succeed SO far so good.

My $0.02

Mike

[dragoon500ly]

Words cannot begin to express my horror and rage at this senseless slaughter of innocents. There can never be an adequate explanation of why someone would believe that this would make things in their world right. Nothing can ever justify the murder of children.

That this individual had severe mental issues cannot be denied, the question is why these issues were not addressed in time to prevent this will be endlessly debated. But the killer has achieved one goal, he will now be remembered.

There are blogs out on the net right now, talking about how "cool" this killer is for "doing it to the man" and "he should have killed more of the little piggies."

Our society has reached a new low. And I fear for that society.

[pmulcahy11b]

Words cannot begin to express my horror and rage at this senseless slaughter of innocents. There can never be an adequate explanation of why someone would believe that this would make things in their world right. Nothing can ever justify the murder of children.

That this individual had severe mental issues cannot be denied, the question is why these issues were not addressed in time to prevent this will be endlessly debated. But the killer has achieved one goal, he will now be remembered.

There are blogs out on the net right now, talking about how "cool" this killer is for "doing it to the man" and "he should have killed more of the little piggies."

Our society has reached a new low. And I fear for that society.

Though I understand that the mentally ill should by and large not be allowed to own firearms, I hope they don't use this incident as a sort of open season against the mentally ill. We are a grossly-misunderstood minority in this country and virtually none of us are dangerous in everyday life.

And I don't think this should be used to pass more anti-firearms legislation. Both anti-gun and gun nuts are going to react in a knee-jerk fashion. We don't really need new legislation -- we need good, tight enforcement of what we have. Enforcement of gun legislation sucks right now in this country. And if you're going to have a firearm, you have to expect that you have a responsibility to handle, care, and store that firearm properly, perhaps more than your responsibility to keep your driving skills and knowledge of driving laws up to par.

People who even point a firearm at a civilian is wrong. No two ways about it. Anyone who is more than a few days into Basic knows that, and classes that teach such gun basics should be a part of every gun license.

You shoot at kids you're not only a fucking coward, you deserve (to turn a phrase) a special place in hell.