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  • #46
    Originally posted by Legbreaker View Post
    With regard to calling fire, over here every infantryman is taught the basics and told that if the shit hits the fan, don't worry about getting it "right", just get some information back to the supporting unit and keep answering their questions to the best of your ability. It may take a little longer to get rounds onto the intended target than it would a properly trained MFO, etc, but they will get there and possibly even save your backside.
    It is the same here.

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    • #47
      FIRE MISSION (SUPPRESSION)

      Observer
      H18 THIS IS H24 SUPPRESS AB3104 OVER.

      FDC
      THIS IS H18, SUPPRESS AB3104, AUTHENTICATE DELTA JULIET, OVER.

      Observer
      I AUTHENTICATE DELTA, OUT.

      FIRE MISSION (IMMEDIATE SUPPRESSION)

      Observer
      H18 THIS IS H24, IMMEDIATE SUPPRESSION GRID 211432 AUTHENTICATION IS TANGO UNIFORM OVER.

      FDC
      THIS IS H18, IMMEDIATE SUPPRESSION, GRID 211432, OUT.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by Legbreaker View Post
        During WWI it was the Australians who first developed "fire and movement", which almost everyone who wants to survive on a battlefield in the last century now uses in some variation or another. Australians were the first to apply common sense and get down on their bellies and crawl across the field.
        This was preceded by the Germans. As ArmySgt mentioned about the Sturmtruppen, they were the real designers of employing fire and movement tactics - doing so from the onset of the war and well ahead of the allies.

        It took some time to recall the name, but I remember this book is fairly decent in giving detailed perspective of the evolution of modern infantry tactics, including exerts from original German publications. I'd recommend it for fans of WW1 history.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Fusilier View Post
          This was preceded by the Germans. As ArmySgt mentioned about the Sturmtruppen, they were the real designers of employing fire and movement tactics - doing so from the onset of the war and well ahead of the allies.
          A quick google search does not seem to bear this statement out. All references I can find indicate it wasn't until later in 1915 that the Germans finally put those techniques into practice and it was in fact the French (Captain Andre Laffargue) who first publicly proposed their use through a pamphlet he published. Sure the germans organised a unit prior to this, but they didn't see combat as intended until October 1915.

          Even so, those units had more in common with "heavy" infantry, than using fire and movement, staying close to the ground, using cover and concealment and direct fire support from intergrated elements. The originally organised unit were actually equiped with heavy shields and body armour - hard to crawl in that!

          Meanwhile the Australians were putting these things into practise.
          If it moves, shoot it, if not push it, if it still doesn't move, use explosives.

          Nothing happens in isolation - it's called "the butterfly effect"

          Mors ante pudorem

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Legbreaker View Post
            A quick google search does not seem to bear this statement out. All references I can find indicate it wasn't until later in 1915 that the Germans finally put those techniques into practice and it was in fact the French (Captain Andre Laffargue) who first publicly proposed their use through a pamphlet he published. Sure the germans organised a unit prior to this, but they didn't see combat as intended until October 1915.

            Even so, those units had more in common with "heavy" infantry, than using fire and movement, staying close to the ground, using cover and concealment and direct fire support from intergrated elements. The originally organised unit were actually equiped with heavy shields and body armour - hard to crawl in that!

            Meanwhile the Australians were putting these things into practise.
            They did in fact use it much earlier than that in combat, but you have to keep in mind that the Germany of the time was not as cohesive as the western nations, being made up of unified umm... states. They didn't all follow one doctrine and all experimented with their own in some cases. It was as early as 1914 in the opening campaigns that German formations were utilizing the fire and movement tactics that were later adopted by the rest of the German forces and allies alike.

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            • #51
              and since oddly it hasn't been mentioned yet. the FPF(final protective fires AKA "oh god, oh god, we're all gonna die")

              a pre-planned linear target. always fired as and immediate suppression with the caviate that they keep firing until the mission is canceled, they run out of ammo, or the barrels melt. granted while a good FO always has one planned for every position they plan to hold for any period of time, if they actually wind up using it there normally are medals handed out after.

              for more information consult FM 6-30 Observed Fires
              Last edited by bobcat; 10-12-2011, 09:41 PM. Reason: references
              the best course of action when all is against you is to slow down and think critically about the situation. this way you are not blindly rushing into an ambush and your mind is doing something useful rather than getting you killed.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Ronin View Post
                As for Australian tactics, I have one word for you, Gallipoli. All the armies back then compared to now were ignorant, and wasteful. Sending men to die for no reason.
                Ouch. Although to be fair Gallipoli wasn't our show. The British planned it, executed it and f*cked it up. They landed the Allied forces in the wrong place just for starters. We learned our lesson long ago. For a long time now when Australian soldiers die in wars they do so under Australian command. We're no longer so willing to be used as cannon fodder by British generals.
                sigpic "It is better to be feared than loved" - Nicolo Machiavelli

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