Combat Tactics and Strategies

[Earthpig]

Guys, I don't want to put words in Chalklines mouth or otherwise speak for him but I think you're all getting the wrong idea about the intention of Chalklines post.
None of us who actually play in it are bitching about the game.

Those of us who play in it understand and accept why we are where we have come to.

So to get the thread back on track I'll give some more background info.

First off we're not the typical raggedey assed motely bunch of player characters typical of any T2K I've been involved with or even seen before.

We are, or were, nearly company strength. At our strongest I think we fielded three allmost full platoons and a small HQ Det with some hangers on. We have suffered many casualties, and no small amount of desertion and are current barely fielding three full squads.
A significant number of the troops are REMF Clercs n' jerks but they are led by competent seargentry with a sprinkling of seasoned veterans. Our officer pool on the other hand has been wanting.

We're currently escorting a MASH unit and have just holed up in a town also occupied by some mostly german civillian refugees who have about a squads worth of armed civilian malitia with them.

The reason we're being hounded by SSD-1109 and about a company of VDV Desantniki is because the MASH had been sheltering a Radio intercept/relay team from who'm the Russians have good reason to believe we have inherited vital communications codes and other intelligence. Their mission is to retrieve or destroy this intel and that is why we are where we are.

We're low on fuel.

We have near 50% casualties at the moment.

And, we have a team out looking for intact bridges to cross a nearby river.

Running is not an option.

So back to the question at hand: In urban terrain, what tactics would you use, given about three squads of mediocre US infantry supported by one squad of civillian malitia, to hold off constant harrassment by Spetznas led VDV Desantniki in near company strength

Any claymore mines
Any anti personnel mines
Any explosives
Any LATW's(light Anti Tank Weapons)

1. Use explosives planted along Avenues of approach to either detonate when the "Baddies" come by or to detonate before the battle to create barriers to enemy movement, canalizing them into kill zones. Also you can manufacture pole charges( an explosive charge at the end of a long pole you can use to put the explosive in a window of a building or vehicle hatch. Also booby traps (I like BOOBY traps) placed at points you KNOW they will use like good firing positions and avenues of approach
2. Use anti personnel mines to protect key areas and COVER THEM WITH FIRE (something many people forget to do) and also to canalize the enemy.
3. Claymore mines can be set up to cover dead space (areas not open to your main automatic weapons (machine guns)) they can be used on the end of poles similar to pole charges
4. LATW's can be used in the conventional point and shoot way, to take out the bad guy's vehicles and support by fire positions but can also be(in the case of LAW rockets) set up in a booby trap versus vehicles or personnel. a blasting cap in the back end of the rocket can set it off and have a firing device in the kill zone that the baddies trigger.
I would divide into separate 3-4 man groups out forward and fall back to your main perimeter drawing the bad guy's into your booby traps and kill zones of other groups. Ambush! Ambush! Ambush!


Good luck....sounds like you need it

[simonmark6]

"So back to the question at hand: In urban terrain, what tactics would you use, given about three squads of mediocre US infantry supported by one squad of civillian malitia, to hold off constant harrassment by Spetznas led VDV Desantniki in near company strength"

You sell out the radio team and information in the hope that the Soviets will let you live. Otherwise you fight house to house, blowing holes and retreating and bringing as many houses down on the Soviets as you can to cause casualties, all to buy time to destroy the info or get it off to Command, you can't win this situation.

Again, this is not meant as a criticism on the GM, it's a common trope in Twilight, the PCs get involved in a "one in a million" situation where they have, RESET, vital information, whatever and are hunted down by the authorities. I've seen it happen, commonly it's because the GM introduces a big ticket MCGUFFIN but then realises that the PCs can't survive without the plot protection a novelist gives his heroes.

In a gritty Twilight game, you can't give this to the PCs and eventually either everyone dies or it's an anti-climax where the PCs know they didn't survive by their own devices.

The moral of the story is don't introduce cinematic plots to gritty war stories.

On the other hand, in game, don't see it as a failure, go down with glory. That's how the French Foreign Legion got famous, embrace the hopeless situation, fight the good fight and die with your enemy's heart in your hand.

[Earthpig]

Just thinking it might be the GM's thinking to capture you as a plot device.....but I wouldn't surrender. them Spetznatz boys don't sound very nice

[ChalkLine]

Good call on the tactics guys, and cheers to Bradbru for making it clear we don't want to whinge about the game. Yeah, it's tough and we're probably going to go down clawing and scratching, but hey - I can always use the PC in another game! Really, it's a lot of fun and our GM puts a huge effort into personalising every member of the NPC category, including an entire company.

I guess, looking at what simonmark6 says in his great post, that we're just going to have to accept giving up ground and tighten the perimeter while still leaving room to move. I was really hesitant about letting the OPFOR into the village because they can simply tighten the noose, but in our position you have to give something to avoid casualties.

From a gamer standpoint - and this has nothing to do with tactics - I'd rather the line was smaller because then PCs are closer together and more able to interact.

I've got to start looking at end games, and see if I can plot a run out of the village and back the way we came if all else barks.

How about moving reserves about in a radio free environment Anyone got any thoughts on how you'd do this

[pmulcahy11b]

How about moving reserves about in a radio free environment Anyone got any thoughts on how you'd do this

Are you in a position to string wire for field telephones Or, as an expedient, are there any relatively intact barbed-wire fences around that you can hook your field telephones into (I've done that; it actually does work, as long as the fence isn't too rusty.)

[kcdusk]

Can you set fire to your surrounding buildings Fire might drive them back, or burn down there cover. Just need to be careful it doesnt turn back on you.

[Legbreaker]

I believe the problem is partly one of mindset.

It seems everyone is thinking defensively and ignoring the fact that the Spetznaz have to have somewhere they're operating from. Why not sent out small patrols of your best people to find them and attack before they can do it to your PCs and allied forces

As any infantryman should know, even when in defence, patrols must be sent out in an attempt to keep the enemy away from your positions. Once they're assaulting, it's already too late as they're likely to have scouted the position, worked out fields of fire, barbed wire, mines, etc, etc, etc and come up with a plan for avoiding/neutralising it all. If you can keep them away from the position in the first place, or at least delay their intel gathering efforts, you've bought yourself a good deal of time to further develop defences, prepare withdrawal routes, and so on.

Fixed defences can work, but they work best by denying intel about them from the enemy....

And don't forget that the best defence is a good offence.

[simonmark6]

I was under the impression that the attack was already under way, in which case patrolling would be pointless. If however the attack hasn't happened yet, it's a viable option.

Mind you, pitting Spetznatz and an airborne company against three squads of clerks and mechanics, the Soviets would probably have a field day cutting them apart and surrounding them as they attacked.

[ChalkLine]

My first thought was that the radio jammer should be easy to find; a directional antenna would be easy to make. Then a strike force goes out, blows the bastard up and we call for help.

I wanted to run this past the CO, but as simonmark6 said, the probe is still under way and real time intel is what's needed.

[kato13]

Had to remove some unpleasantness to end it. That thread is now locked. Hopefully it will fall off the front page soon and all will be forgotten.

I do have to say that I am a little frustrated that every time if feel I can take a break from my babysitting of this board, ridiculous overreactions start to occur from everyone involved in what should be a minor disagreement.

I'm leaving the board for at least a day because mentally I just have to. So play nice or you will only be crapping in your own bed.

[simonmark6]

'Yes the fight is allready underway. We reached the outskirts of the town before light, having suffered a dusk ambush on the way. We waited untill light to move the bulk of our forces in. We really haven't had any time to set up mines, or booby traps etc allthough as a player I've made it clear I wanted to. We have a mortar and some ammunition for it but our radios are being jammed. SSD-1109 does stand for Special Signals Detatchment afterall. We took harrassing sniper fire during the morning and have now lost one fire team from an aggressive probe which we are repelling now, with even more casualties...'

OK, there are some possibilities from this information. If you get the opportunity, finding out where the jammer is would be vital. If you can knock it out, great, but I wouldn't risk too many people, your very best two or three fighters might have a better chance than a squad.

Bear in mind that all the below assume you get some time to breath. My opinion would be that this time would be best spent fleeing. If, however you can't do this:

Using your mortar will probably be vital too. Place it somewhere where a spotter can relay corrections, if you can, or where you can channel the enemy into a kill zone you've set up, with time you could pre-register fire, but the enemy might clock on to that.

If you have mines, again used them to channel the enemy.

Other tricks:
Set bait in your kill zone, by now the enemy might have such a poor opinion of you that they'll get cocky

Set up sneaky ambushes (again, time reliant), if you have vehicles, use the tire jacks for a Chechen trick, burrow under a collapsed wall and use the jack to raise it up a bit. Fire at the enemy and release the jack. Hey presto, they can't find you. A few tricks like that might rattle the Airborne, or at least take out a couple of soldiers. If you can go for wounds rather than kills, an injured soldier is a logistical nightmare, a dead one, a resupply opportunity.

In an urban environment think in 3 dimensions and remember explosives are your friends. Don't cross roads when you can go under, don't go around houses, go through.

Good luck, a few lucky ambushes and luring the bulk of the enemy into a kill zone might cause enough casualties for the enemy to break off. Otherwise, it's 'Saving Private Ryan' time, take out as many as you can before you go down.

Remember, your campaign has evolved into something greater than a game, I know, I've read and admired it. There are two ways to go:

Win or die gloriously in the attempt.
Don't feel cheated if the GM has a Deus Ex Machina up his sleeve, your writing has earned you just a little bit of plot protection just as a fictional character would.

Anyway, good luck, and most of all, enjoy the game, I admire what you've all created.

All the best,

Mark.

[Haven]

Any chance of a link so i can lurk

PM if you don't want it open to the world or whatever =)

[Raellus]

In Grozny, the Chechnyans would rig a building with massive demolitions charges. They would then occupy it, fire from it to lure in enemy units, withdraw when Russian infantry looked ready to assault it, and then blow it up when the Russians took posession. Then, if it looked like they could press the advantage, they would counterattack.

I think someone (not I) suggested preparing such a trap in the game (OOC) before it shut down last year. I can't recall why it wasn't implemented.

The Chechyans really perfected urban wafare against a larger, better equiped enemy force.

[headquarters]

hehe

sounds like a cool mission for the party - sit on top of massive demolition charges and draw the Red Army to you and make them attack and take your position...

thanks for that one .