49th Armoured Division

[Panther Al]

Thanks, I haven't finished with the document yet but haven't fully worked out the future of the 49th. Personally I see it withering away leaving a headquarters made up of the command staff and little else (which is operating under greater and greater delusions) but I can be persuaded to do things differently.

Eventually I think it will get its act back together: If one goes by what 2300's timeline says about Texas, for the 49th would play a huge role in it.

[Olefin]

I dont see it being reduced to just a deluded HQ. For one it clearly says the division fights for several years after the BMP joins them in 1999. That clearly shows a division with a least some fighting capability beyond that of a mere HQ cadre for several yeas to come.

[Webstral]

At long last, I've taken the time to really look at your work on the 49th Armored Division, James.

I love the effort that went into showing pre-war and post-Exchange TO&E (table of organization and equipment) for 49th AD. Great effort! Im especially appreciate that you made an obvious effort to tie the post-Exchange TO&E in with the tanks listed as belonging to 49th AD in the US Army Vehicle Guide. You did a good job explaining the presence of M1 and M2 in the division, too.

I appreciate as well the presence of USAF and Dept of Energy crews and fighting vehicles in the division. Good creativity! I notice that by early 1999 the surviving LAV75 appear to have been concentrated in the new divisional cavalry squadron.

Maneuver battalions and artillery battalions are listed with hyphens between the battalion number and the parent regiment instead of slashes: 1-184 IN for 1st Battalion of the 184th Infantry Regiment, 4-64 AR for 4th Battalion of the 64th Armored Regiment, and 3-78 FA for 3rd Battalion of the 78th Field Artillery Regiment. Companies within the battalion are separated from the battalion number with a slash; B/1-18 IN for Bravo Company, 1st Battalion of the 184th Infantry Regiment.

To make matters more confusing, most battalions in the US Army do not follow the same nomenclature system as the maneuver battalions. I served in the 4th Engineer Battalion (Mech). No fancy numbering or anything.

The School Brigade TO&E for late August 1998 is good but could stand a tweak or two. By the time the brigade has been assigned to front-line combat duty with 49th AD, the corps commander will have transferred the battalion to his command. The Patriots cant do anything useful at the brigade level, given that the School Brigade is entering front-line combat. Also, make some note of the fact that the infantry battalions and ADA battalions will be exchanging companies to make heavy machine gun or autocannon company teams. While any half-informed reader will assume that the armored and infantry battalions are forming combined arms task forces, it may not be as obvious that the ADA battalions and the infantry are doing the same thing, since there is no doctrine for using ADA and infantry in a combined arms role. Otherwise, the School Brigade TO&E looks good. Transferring 1-124 CAV from the 49th AD is a nice touch.

The loss of 1600 replacements en route from Virginia is painful. Its also very Twilight: 2000. Good one!

The list of commanding generals is a nice creative gesture. Again, I like the attention to detail that goes into this sort of thing.

A very, very nice bit of work, James!

[James Langham]

Latest version. unusually for me it is quite pessimistic. As ever comments welcome.

[Rainbow Six]

James, great article. I particularly enjoyed the part at the end where you detailed some of the Division's notable members. One minor point - dates don't tally in Major Turner's bio - think you might have a typo in the date of his death (Jan 01 - should this be Jan 02)

[James Langham]

James, great article. I particularly enjoyed the part at the end where you detailed some of the Division's notable members. One minor point - dates don't tally in Major Turner's bio - think you might have a typo in the date of his death (Jan 01 - should this be Jan 02)

It should indeed by 02

[Webstral]

That is bleak.

[pmulcahy11b]

I know there's no real justification for it, but I'm not only a San Antonian and Texan, but I'm a former member of 1/141. I can't see the 49th just disintegrating like that. Like I said in an earlier post, The 49th can make a mess out of a unit that underestimates them -- we made messes out of visiting National Guard units, Air Force Defenders, and even active duty units. Cohesion may come a bit slowly, my guess is that by 1997, they will be operating in sync.

[Targan]

Cohesion may come a bit slowly, my guess is that by 1997, they will be operating in sync.

Arrrrrgh! Oh wait, not the boy band. My bad.

[Olefin]

I have to agree with pmulcahy11b - we know that the 49th survives with at least the BMP-C mentioned in the Soviet Vehicle Guide for several years after 1999 so your final entry of the division being folded into another division is a little too pessimistic in my opinion.

One thing you may want to think about is posssibly would the 49th members who left possibly join up with the South Texas Grange forces mentioned in Red Star, Lone Star I.e. instead of just dispersing in dribs and drabs to their homes would they have joined up with the nascent Texas Republic as an organized military unit, but not one under US MilGov control

In other words not deserting or going over the hill but deciding that they are Texas units and should be fighting for Texas and not for the US Perhaps not everyone but a substantial force of them, especially if that force starts to win ground against the Texians or Mexicans with the oil that the South Texas Grange now has available

[James Langham]

I have to agree with pmulcahy11b - we know that the 49th survives with at least the BMP-C mentioned in the Soviet Vehicle Guide for several years after 1999 so your final entry of the division being folded into another division is a little too pessimistic in my opinion.

One thing you may want to think about is posssibly would the 49th members who left possibly join up with the South Texas Grange forces mentioned in Red Star, Lone Star I.e. instead of just dispersing in dribs and drabs to their homes would they have joined up with the nascent Texas Republic as an organized military unit, but not one under US MilGov control

In other words not deserting or going over the hill but deciding that they are Texas units and should be fighting for Texas and not for the US Perhaps not everyone but a substantial force of them, especially if that force starts to win ground against the Texians or Mexicans with the oil that the South Texas Grange now has available

Ive tried not to mention the possibility of the South Texas Grange as I can't decide which way to go with them. I think really they need to be considered for each campaign. 2300 has Texas under Mexican control but Red Star, Lone Star implies they may succeed so I try to leave things like that open. I may well add a note that some operate with the Kingsleys. Texas might well use the 49th as a division for the historical precedent.

[Olefin]

You are right in the implication -i.e. the very strong implication that Kingsley would be the first president of a Lone Star Republic is a huge hint that maybe they rethought the "Texas is part of Mexico" part of 2300.

Also remember that you could have Texas possibly broken into multiple areas - i.e. an area that stays with the US as Texas but is much smaller than before (say northern Texas) , another that is taken over by Mexico (the area below San Antonio for instance but not along the Gulf Coast where the refinery was) and a third area that becomes the Republic of Texas - all very much Texas but none of them being the Texas that we know now.

You could even end up with rival 49th Divisions - one being in Texas and one being in the US.

[kalos72]

Side note of sorts:

Where can I find the background story your talking about for Texas and 2300AD What book or article

[Targan]

2300 has Texas under Mexican control...

It does Which version The original Traveller:2300 I have has Texas as an independent republic for hundreds of years after the Twilight War.

[Webstral]

The Earth-Cybertech Sourcebook also lists Texas as an independent republic.