Twilight 2013 - How are you going to use it?

[Targan]

I will have a lot more to say about T:2013 both here and elsewhere very soon but let me say this now, in brief: I'm not really down with the 2013 timeline (I agree strongly with many of the views of those at this forum who are critical of the timeline) but...

[this may come as a huge shock to those of you who know well my love for the system I currently use]

... the 2013 combat and character generation systems are the bomb. Seriously very, very good work. In my opinion those two facets alone justify its purchase. The new rules absolutely address most of the problems that many people active on this forum have previously pointed out with previous editions of T2K. I think that combining the revised timeline being developed by the DC Working Group and these new 2013 rules could be used to create new campaigns of real quality and excellence.

I urge those of you who have serious problems with the 2013 timeline to ignore that timeline and have a good look at the 2013 combat and char gen rules because they are things of great beauty.

[Snake Eyes]

Apparently another option needs to be added to the poll:

"I won't actually stoop to paying for 2013 but I'll gleefully download a pirated .torrent of it."

[LAW0306]

i would not even waste my time to do that.........

[Mohoender]

And I thought I could have been mean. You are a bit hard guys.

[pmulcahy11b]

Apparently another option needs to be added to the poll:

"I won't actually stoop to paying for 2013 but I'll gleefully download a pirated .torrent of it."

Oh, I'd use Usenet. BitTorrent is spyware!

[Targan]

Jokes aside, 93 Games Studio is a small operation and even if people have issues with the timeline in the game or whatever I would strongly urge people not to seek pirate copies of the game. The authors and developers have put years of their lives and some of their hearts and souls into this project. They are T2Kers just like us. They deserve some level of respect at least for those reasons.

Just sayin'.

[Mohoender]

Jokes aside, 93 Games Studio is a small operation and even if people have issues with the timeline in the game or whatever I would strongly urge people not to seek pirate copies of the game. The authors and developers have put years of their lives and some of their hearts and souls into this project. They are T2Kers just like us. They deserve some level of respect at least for those reasons.

Just sayin'.

I agree, couldn't say better. Moreover, they still do as proven by their website.

[pmulcahy11b]

Jokes aside, 93 Games Studio is a small operation and even if people have issues with the timeline in the game or whatever I would strongly urge people not to seek pirate copies of the game. The authors and developers have put years of their lives and some of their hearts and souls into this project. They are T2Kers just like us. They deserve some level of respect at least for those reasons.

Just sayin'.

Yeah I know -- it'll be a late Christmas present for myself.

[Tegyrius]

I found them very poor when it comes to equipments and even more so when it come to illiustration (a pity).

The other weak point is about the equipments but that is from personnal taste. I like to have a wide range of equipments to draw on.

I'm curious as to why you consider the equipment selection poor. I'll admit that we don't have as much in the way of military small arms as 2.0/2.2 did, but the civilian selection is much larger (if anyone's interested about the reasoning behind that design decision, there's a discussion of it over in the 93GS weapons forum). As for non-weapon equipment... maybe I'm misunderstanding your point, but the 2013 core book has 36 pages of non-weapon personal gear, compared to six in the 2.0 core. That doesn't really feel "poor" to me, but I'm a bit biased...

- C.

[Tegyrius]

The background, no matter how good, wont replace v1.0. But for new (ie under 25 years of age) players a new background that sits better with their own real world history it might suit.

I totally agree with you about this point. I have forgotten all the new blood that may be wishing to explore the possibilities of a new Twilight setup. Mmmmm.. perhaps I'm getting older

That was a not-insignificant decision that we made very early in the design process. We could have gone with a third Cold War alternate history, but we chose to build this apocalypse on today's fears rather than those of two decades ago. Quite frankly, we expected a significant portion of the existing fan base to have the reaction to our storyline that I'm seeing here. However, I'd like to think that the Reflex System is just as viable for use with the 1.0 and 2.0/2.2 timelines as it is with ours. Some modifications to the Last Year lifepath phases would be in order, but that's a trivial task.

- C.

[Tegyrius]

I don't want to speak for law but I understand his position to a degree. When T2013 started development the people from there who originally contacted this board were quite arrogant and condescending to our members. I will admit it left a very bad taste in my mouth which has never really gone away. (Just want to note smokewolf has been totally honorable and I have no beef with him at all)

Kato, I've been chewing this one over since this thread came to my attention last week, and I have to admit that I'm more than a little perplexed by your statement here. I kept a fairly low profile on both this board and the various T2k mailing lists because of a few vocally negative reactions to early information about the 2013 project, and because Keith (smokewolf) was handling playtester/consultant recruiting along with all other personnel matters. I know a few of our playtesters are active here, but I think it'd be obvious if you were referring to them. As far as I can recall, the only person to whom I've coldly and deliberately been an ass in my "2013 systems guy" persona was Justin Oldham on our forums, and, given the provocation he offered, I still stand by my statements in that thread. If I said something in this forum's previous incarnation that gave offense to a specific member or the general audience, please bring it to my attention.

The true irony is that Law will give his work away while T2013 will charge for it (not that I blame them). The "amateur" who does it only out of passion not personal gain will actually have more esteem in my eyes, even if the quality of the work was equal.

I've often said that this industry is really more of a subsidized hobby. In a lot of cases, the only difference between "amateur" and "professional" is that the so-called pro was lucky enough to catch the attention of a developer or publisher and stupid enough to sign a contract. However, no one gets rich doing this. We're all doing it out of passion.

- C.

[kato13]

maybe I'm misunderstanding your point, but the 2013 core book has 36 pages of non-weapon personal gear, compared to six in the 2.0 core.
- C.

This is the first thing I have read that really interests me about T2013. I am a bit of an equipment and logistics nut.

Since I have not posted one for a while here is a shameless plug for my gaming site, which will eventually have a full character shopping cart system, allowing you to equip characters with any of the literally thousands of pieces of equipment I am currently databasing.

http://games.juhlin.com (sorry you have to register again I was not able to unify the logins when RPGhost closing early forced the forum launch)

[Tegyrius]

This is the first thing I have read that really interests me about T2013. I am a bit of an equipment and logistics nut.

Oh, good! Now I know who to blame for stacking my poll on future equipment support.

Since I have not posted one for a while here is a shameless plug for my gaming site, which will eventually have a full character shopping cart system, allowing you to equip characters with any of the literally thousands of pieces of equipment I am currently databasing.

I'll register and poke at it after dinner. This looks to be made of pure awesome.

- C.

[Twilight2000v3MM]

I don't want to speak for law but I understand his position to a degree. When T2013 started development the people from there who originally contacted this board were quite arrogant and condescending to our members. I will admit it left a very bad taste in my mouth which has never really gone away. (Just want to note smokewolf has been totally honorable and I have no beef with him at all)

The DC working group (of which Law is a member) have crafted wonderfully logical and beautifully flowing time lines. They are working harder than anyone I know to provide us the best and most accurate background information. If in his opinion his work is superior I do not doubt him. The evidence I have seen supports that position IMHO.

The true irony is that Law will give his work away while T2013 will charge for it (not that I blame them). The "amateur" who does it only out of passion not personal gain will actually have more esteem in my eyes, even if the quality of the work was equal.

That being said we are all friends here and I hope that T2013 never creates factions and just gives everyone more options on whatever path they choose.

Kato brother... uhmm.. who was condesending I hope I wasn't 'cause I've been workign onthis project since 1996 (yea... 1996). When Mr. Taylor got a hold of me (early 2006 I think) I jumped right on board. BTW gang ... neither Snake or I get paid for our contribution - we both turned it down.

I DON'T wanna start any flaming or anything but guys, really, please look at the rules and read them over before you make any decisions. If you're not happy withthe timeline hey then use your own or use the old one. The timeline is "vague" for a reason.

AND Im a HUGE gear whore - let me correect myself - WHORE and Im very happy with the work that was done in the book.

We are ALL brothers in here with the same goal in mind. Having fun correct

Max

[kato13]

Kato brother... uhmm.. who was condesending I hope I wasn't 'cause I've been workign onthis project since 1996 (yea... 1996). When Mr. Taylor got a hold of me (early 2006 I think) I jumped right on board. BTW gang ... neither Snake or I get paid for our contribution - we both turned it down.

I honestly don't remember all the details as I was not personally involved, though i believe accusations of lying were thrown about. I remember being really excited and then dejected after seeing really bad interactions. As someone who had thought about T2k practically every day (little things like while driving thinking "what would have happened to that fence, generator, or water tower") it must have been serious to have deflated my balloon like that.

I just want to make it clear that my recent interactions with the 93GS people have been exemplary and my interest has now overcome all of my original negativity. I was only being honest about what I remember.