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The Best That Never Was 2 (Prototypes)

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  • Although the following site is Brazilian so the language is Brazilian Portuguese, there's a lot of useful images for the F-18L including some data sheets for those inclined to do the stats.

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    • Speaking of the Canadian New Fighter Aircraft, it's worth noting that before the "Canadian Caper" in Iran (popularized in Argo), Canada was in negotiations to acquire Iran's F-14 Tomcats as their replacement for the Voodoo and Starfighter. It would take only a very mild historical tweak for Canada to be flying Tomcats in the 1980s and 90s.
      The poster formerly known as The Dark

      The Vespers War - Ninety years before the Twilight War, there was the Vespers War.

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      • Originally posted by Vespers War View Post
        Speaking of the Canadian New Fighter Aircraft, it's worth noting that before the "Canadian Caper" in Iran (popularized in Argo), Canada was in negotiations to acquire Iran's F-14 Tomcats as their replacement for the Voodoo and Starfighter. It would take only a very mild historical tweak for Canada to be flying Tomcats in the 1980s and 90s.
        Very interesting! Are there any websites - in preference to books - that go into any detail about this (I'm interested in reading more about this but not so interested in laying out money for a book that may have only a few paragraphs on the subject!)

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        • Originally posted by StainlessSteelCynic View Post
          Very interesting! Are there any websites - in preference to books - that go into any detail about this (I'm interested in reading more about this but not so interested in laying out money for a book that may have only a few paragraphs on the subject!)
          Tacairnet has a small piece about the CF-14-Eh.
          The poster formerly known as The Dark

          The Vespers War - Ninety years before the Twilight War, there was the Vespers War.

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          • Originally posted by Vespers War View Post
            Tacairnet has a small piece about the CF-14-Eh.
            Very interesting indeed, thanks for the link.
            And to think the Canadians practically had it all in the bag until the Iranians found out about the "Caper".
            Would have made a very different Cold War landscape in North America if the Canadians were flying Tomcats but I'm left to wonder how they would have made nice with Grumman (I'm presuming Grumman would have remained unhappy with the Canadian's lower cost purchase and also that Canada would eventually have to get new spares etc. etc. from Grumman at some point in time).

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            • Originally posted by StainlessSteelCynic View Post
              Very interesting indeed, thanks for the link.
              And to think the Canadians practically had it all in the bag until the Iranians found out about the "Caper".
              Would have made a very different Cold War landscape in North America if the Canadians were flying Tomcats but I'm left to wonder how they would have made nice with Grumman (I'm presuming Grumman would have remained unhappy with the Canadian's lower cost purchase and also that Canada would eventually have to get new spares etc. etc. from Grumman at some point in time).
              In a non-Twilight scenario, it also makes me wonder if the Canadian use of the Tomcat would have prevented Cheney from having the tooling scrapped in the early 90s and left an updated Tomcat as a potential candidate for the fleet defense role on US carriers instead of the Super Hornet. The longer-ranged AMRAAM makes the Phoenix mostly obsolete, but the F-14's track-while-scan capability is (to the best of my knowledge) still unmatched by carrier-capable aircraft.
              The poster formerly known as The Dark

              The Vespers War - Ninety years before the Twilight War, there was the Vespers War.

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              • Here's one that's more forgotten than never was.

                In 1923, Poland started a competition for a new light machinegun. The next year, the Ministry of War purchased a dozen each of the Benet-Mercie, Lewis, and the eventual winner, the BAR. Guns were bought from Belgium starting in 1927, chambered in 7.92mm Mauser instead of .30-06, to the tune of 10,000. License production in Poland then began, and another 14,000 were built before 1939. They saw use not just with the Polish Army (and partisans during WW2), but captured units were used by both the Soviets and the Germans, and earlier some had been shipped to the Spanish Republic, Greece, China, and Palestine.

                Wt 5.9 kg, ROF 5, Dam 4, Pen 2-3-Nil, Blk 7, Mag 20, SS 4, Brst 9, Rng 93.

                Compared to the original M1918, a little bit of weight has been shaved off and the burst recoil has increased from 8 to 9 as a result, while an extra 10 meters of short range has been added (due to a longer barrel). The Polish BAR also had a pistol grip. While produced in decent numbers, it's been overshadowed by the far more common American BAR.
                The poster formerly known as The Dark

                The Vespers War - Ninety years before the Twilight War, there was the Vespers War.

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                • An 18th-century best that never was is the infamous Puckle Gun. An early manual repeater, it was a 32mm smoothbore black powder revolver mounted on a tripod with a 3 foot barrel. It has a nine-shot cylinder. A crank at the rear cams a cylinder to or from the breech, and when cammed back the cylinder can be manually rotated. A flintlock fire mechanism at the top of the frame will drop sparks into a priming pan and fire the top-most chamber. Rotating the crank all the way back allows the cylinder to be removed and replaced. A single shot can be fired per 5-second round, and replacing a cylinder requires three rounds, so a cylinder can be fired and replaced in one minute for an average rate of fire of 9 rounds per minute.

                  A grand total of two Puckle Guns were purchased for an expedition to the West Indies. The expedition was a failure and it's not known if the Puckle Guns were ever fired in anger.

                  Puckle Gun (3.2 cm L/28)
                  Gun Weight: 40 kg
                  Tripod Weight: 10 kg
                  SAR, Mag 9, Rld 3, Bulk 8, SS 2, Rng 90 (SS and Rng include tripod bonus)

                  Shot: Dam: 7 Pen: 2-Nil
                  Canister: B: 45 Dam 2/1 Pen: 1-Nil

                  Each loaded cylinder is approximately 5 kilograms. Loading a single chamber takes 2 actions, so it requires 18 actions to fully reload a cylinder. Three cylinders and a crew of 3 (1 gunner, 2 loaders) should be able to keep a Puckle Gun firing at its maximum rate, though extra cylinders may be desirable to maintain flexibility between shot and canister. Explosive shell was not developed due to a lack of reliable detonator; if it was developed it would be B: 4, C: -1, Pen: Nil. If an effective shrapnel shell was developed, it would be B: 8, Dam: 2/1, Pen: 1-Nil.
                  The poster formerly known as The Dark

                  The Vespers War - Ninety years before the Twilight War, there was the Vespers War.

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                  • something bigger than the latest round. MD-17

                    Boeing hopes to launch the MD-17 Commercial Globemaster by the end of 1998 and has begun briefing airlines, cargo specialists and handling agents for the first time after receiving the go-ahead from the Commercial Airplane Group. The company kicked off its marketing effort at Asian Aerospace and predicts ...

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                    • Originally posted by cawest View Post
                      something bigger than the latest round. MD-17

                      https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...-launch-33860/
                      They were still at it a decade later (with a designation change to get rid of the McDonnell-Douglas prefix):



                      One reason it never really caught on is that it had 3/4 of the fuel consumption but only 1/2 the cargo capacity of a 747-400. Unless you absolutely needed the rough field capability, it was an economic stinker.
                      The poster formerly known as The Dark

                      The Vespers War - Ninety years before the Twilight War, there was the Vespers War.

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                      • Maybe, but loading cargo on a 747-400 is VERY time consuming compared to a C-17. A C-17 can be downloaded and uploaded with a full load of cargo, including rolling stock, in a bit more than three hours. A 747-400 will take at least twice as long and no rolling stock. Ground time cost money, so in the long run my bet is that a BC-17 will generate more revenue, because you can get more ton-mileage per day compared to a 747-400.

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                        • Originally posted by mpipes View Post
                          Maybe, but loading cargo on a 747-400 is VERY time consuming compared to a C-17. A C-17 can be downloaded and uploaded with a full load of cargo, including rolling stock, in a bit more than three hours. A 747-400 will take at least twice as long and no rolling stock. Ground time cost money, so in the long run my bet is that a BC-17 will generate more revenue, because you can get more ton-mileage per day compared to a 747-400.
                          that is why the an-124 has been working so hard with civilian cargos.

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                          • It's been far too long since a Best That Never Was, and I've been watching some of Ian's videos again while waiting for new C&Rsenal videos.

                            The Colt-Franklin is a historical oddity as a black powder bolt-action magazine-fed rifle. The magazine is a 9-round box mounted above and to the left of the receiver. And it is a box. A square box, with the rounds in a 3x3 grid and feeding in a serpentine pattern to a Krag-like loading tray on the left side of the chamber. There's no spring in the magazine; the shaking of the rifle's recoil is sufficient to feed rounds. It also has 9 small holes, 1 behind each of the cartridge slots, as an easy method of checking how many rounds are left in the magazine.

                            Chambered for .45-70 Government, 50 rifles were manufactured and were tested by both the Navy and Army in 1887. They were not accepted for service, but did pass all the tests they were subjected to and would make an interesting weapon either for a black powder enthusiast in the Twilight era or for a Space: 1889 campaign. I only have caliber, barrel length, and overall length for the rifle's physical characteristics, so weight is as-calculated in FF&S.

                            Colt Franklin Bolt-Action Rifle
                            Wt 5.35 kg, ROF BA, Dam 3, Pen Nil, Blk 9, Mag 9, Rcl 2, Rng 112
                            The poster formerly known as The Dark

                            The Vespers War - Ninety years before the Twilight War, there was the Vespers War.

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                            • For those wanting some visuals of the Colt-Franklin, check out the following from (no surprises here) Forgotten Weapons: -
                              https://youtu.be/GS3RccZ5SC0 This is lot #3213 in the upcoming RIA Premier Auction. It was scheduled for April, but has been postponed - check their web site for upcoming Online Only auctions every month, though! Patented in 1884 and designed by retired Civil War General William Franklin, this was an effort by Colt to win a military

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                              • Originally posted by Vespers War View Post
                                An 18th-century best that never was is the infamous Puckle Gun...
                                I have that one on my site, under blackpowder rifles, but I had the impression more were built
                                I'm guided by the beauty of our weapons...First We Take Manhattan, Jennifer Warnes

                                Entirely too much T2K stuff here: www.pmulcahy.com

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