The Best That Never Was 2 (Prototypes)

[Legbreaker]

With the early tanks, the crew would often be injured from spalling when rifle and machinegun bullets hit the armour near them - the reason spall liners are basically standard equipment in AFVs today.
Have you modelled that somehow

[ArmySGT.]

Standard Manufacturing Excalibur 20mm Vulcan SHORAD

[ArmySGT.]

Standard Manufacturing Rough Terrain variable height transporter.

[unkated]

With the early tanks, the crew would often be injured from spalling when rifle and machinegun bullets hit the armour near them - the reason spall liners are basically standard equipment in AFVs today.
Have you modelled that somehow

Nope. None of the versions of T2K have it modeled in vehicle combat, and T2K includes HEAT which creates spalling.

I wanted to have vehicles to compare to existing ones in T2K, not re-invent the combat system, particularly where at the moment I don't contemplate actually using these designs in a game. But i'll bear that in mind for if an when I consider using these vehicles.

Uncle Ted

[Legbreaker]

Pretty much any projectile which hits has the potential to cause spalling - the thicker the armour, the larger the impact or explosion needs to be though. For more modern vehicles spalling is not much of an issue as they're almost invariably fitted with spall liners.
For early AFVs (up to the late 1930's and into the 40's I believe) spall liners where not standard and from what I can find were really only developed in response to the introduction of HESH rounds by the British in the 1940's.
In WWI, AFV crews had to wear armoured masks similar to the one pictured to protect the face and especially eyes from flying shrapnel spalled off the inside of their vehicles armour. Even just the impact of ordinary rifle bullets could be enough to blind a crewman close to the point of impact (a gunner for example looking for targets).

While this is not an issue for T2K era vehicles, probably not even the left over WWII ones (which were likely retrofitted with liners) it is probably something which should be kept in mind if an earlier vehicle was used.

[Draq]

Ok, so there have been plenty of vehicles designed and tested over the years, and the best is not always chosen, for various reasons. What vehicles do you guys think should have been adopted instead of the ones the military picked

[CDAT]

Ok, so there have been plenty of vehicles designed and tested over the years, and the best is not always chosen, for various reasons. What vehicles do you guys think should have been adopted instead of the ones the military picked

I would have liked to see the prototype Abrams with 25mm coax. Once you up-gunned to the 120mm having a coax that can take out the light armor would have been nice.

[WallShadow]

I would have liked to see the prototype Abrams with 25mm coax. Once you up-gunned to the 120mm having a coax that can take out the light armor would have been nice.

You mean like the 20mm secondary anti-soft-skin gun the MBT-70 had

[CDAT]

You mean like the 20mm secondary anti-soft-skin gun the MBT-70 had

Very close, I remember way back when I was at Knox (93') and stopped by the Patton Museum they had one of the XM1's and it had a 25mm (same as the Bradley) as its coax, before it went to production they had swapped it with the M240 of today as the ammo carried was not enough they thought (I think it was something like a 1000rds for the coax, but do not remember for sure.)

[mark w]

the best hovercraft that never was

Hi there
it's a pleasure to have found this board.

I'd like to contribute

The Iron Cow

from The Zone by James Rouch.


FV499 Hover armoured personnel carrier (HAPC).

Crew: commander, driver, gunner, radio/radar operator, plus eight infantry.

Armament: 30mm Rarden cannon, 7.62mm AA machine-gun.

Armour: classified, believed to be composite hull, Chobham turret.

Combat weight: 15.4 tons.

Engines: late production models fitted with twin Allison turbofans developing 2,480 hp max speed; classified.

Systems fitted include NBC, night vision, automatic fire-suppression, ECM, decoy and smoke generation, passive and active locators.

A planned production of 300 was cut to 60 due to shortage of engines. Issue is limited to Armoured Reconnaissance and Special Anti-tank units. In both roles they have proved highly popular with users, exceptional speed and cross-country performance giving them a survival rate three times that of any other NATO combat vehicle. A major drawback of the type is the difficulty of recovery if battle damage results in total loss of power. Plans for a special transporter were shelved when production was curtailed.

* * * * * * *

that's the backstory printed in the 1st book, it needs tweaking to fit into the T2K universe

my attempt at stating it is below

* * * * * * *


Price: $155,000 (---/")
Armament: 30mm RADEN autocannon, GPMG (c)
Ammo:200x30mm. 500x7.62N
Fuel Type: D, A
Load: 400 kg
Veh Wt: 15.4 tonnes
Crew: 4+8
Mnt: 30
night vision: head lights, image intensifier, ground surveillance radar

also equipped with aircraft style chaff, flare and radar jammer pods
(from the nautical/ aviation handbook)

Tr Mov: 240/195
Com Mov: 55/45
Fuel Cap: 250
Fuel Cons: 50

Combat Statistics Config: Shielded
HF: 6-sp Susp: P(8)
HS: 6-sp
HR: 4-sp
TF: 6
TS: 4
TR: 2

* * * * *

DESIGN NOTES
I've ignored the description of a Chobham turret as that does seem to make much sense for an APC.
The hull armour matches that of the level 2 protection for M8 AGS listed in the BYB.
This weighs 6 tonnes and is the difference in weight between the details listed for the Iron Cow & the SK 25 from T2K

regards

mark

[unkated]

XM800T with conventional Hispano Suiza 20mm and M60D

In the bottom picture of the XM800T (see above), is that an IR Spotlight on the right of the turret

Uncle Ted

[StainlessSteelCynic]

The XM800 project was developed for the reconnaissance role but from what little info I could find specifically about the XM800T, it also had the ability to designate targets for other vehicles/aircraft so I think it's probably the surveillance/target designator sight.

[unkated]

The XM800 project was developed for the reconnaissance role but from what little info I could find specifically about the XM800T, it also had the ability to designate targets for other vehicles/aircraft so I think it's probably the surveillance/target designator sight.

Hmm I though that was developed in the late 80s; the XM800T was developed in the mid-1970s. Did we have that capability then

Uncle Ted

[ArmySGT.]

In the bottom picture of the XM800T (see above), is that an IR Spotlight on the right of the turret

Uncle Ted

I don't really know... From the appearance I can only guess......

Appears to me to be either a thermal imager or a low light tv system.

[dragoon500ly]

Supposed to have been a low light tv...