The ANZACs in T2k

[cawest]

ANZAC might get a something along the lines of a few Team Yankees, or a Battalion Task Force on the ground. now it could get a few subs, surface ships or aircraft that were moved out of Pearl, Philippines, diego Garcia, or johnston atoll


now that is a thought what would be at johnston atoll in this time line

[Legbreaker]

Bear in mind I'm not kicking hostilities off in PNG until it's clear the major world players are tied up elsewhere. Just doesn't make much sense for a 2nd rate military power to attack if there's 1st rate armies available to spank them for it.

My thoughts are one, maybe two ships (could be a support vessel, LST or the like instead of a "proper" warship), or a small unit of number of units. The question really is which ones might be available for more than just a brief visit on the way to somewhere else.

Note it doesn't even have to be a combat unit - medical team, engineers, intelligence, etc would all be suitable in my mind. Could even be civilians, or a unit made up of people found somewhat less than suitable for military draft but still very keen to help out in some way.

So lets hear some ideas, wilder the better!

One point I need to stress is PNG has an absolutely ABYSMAL transportation network. There's very limited roads, of which only a tiny percentage is sealed. No railroads at all, except for some short narrow gauge dating from pre WWI which have been neglected for 80 years. They were originally built by the Germans (back when it was still one of their colonies) to service a handful of old mines. Most bulk transport is by small boat along the coastline and up the rivers, and some air transport to very primitive bush airstrips. https://youtu.be/sy_HNd6N4IE

[Olefin]

I could easily see an ad hoc American unit being formed from stranded sailors, airmen, etc. that get stuck in Australia do to various reasons

Heck even just the men and woman manning places like Pine Gap could give you at least a small force to help the Australians out. Add in things like US Marine Corps Marine Security Guard detachments that are in various Asian nations being evacuated to Australia after the war starts from places like Indonesia, Malaysia, etc.. and you have the beginnings of a couple of companies at least - maybe even more.

The Company C Headquarters is located in Bangkok, Thailand and is responsible for 18 detachments located in the Far East, Asia and Australia. You could at the least see the HQ being relocated to Australia in 1997 after the nukes fly, perhaps earlier with embassies being evacuated out of hot spots

Especially if you add in a stranded USN ship or even nuclear sub and its crew being turned into infantry.

[Legbreaker]

The more I look at it, the more I think logistics is the key in PNG rather than another company or two of infantry. Yes, fighting troops are important, but they're useless without supporting units. Stranded US crewmembers might be better utilised running supplies along the coast in commandeered civilian craft rather than handed a rifle and sent to the front line. Their skill set would lend themselves more to that I think.
This opens up a whole new range of possible RP opportunities - US crew on a supply mission gets into trouble in some way and finds themselves behind enemy lines. Or, why not have them shipwrecked somewhere in the Indonesian controlled area and have to get themselves to friendly, Australian lines.

[swaghauler]

GOOGLE the US ARMY'S USAV Major General Robert Smalls with its 13-foot draft, more than 10K kilometer range, and its 6000-ton displacement.

Then GOOGLE USMC "gator fleet."

[StainlessSteelCynic]

GOOGLE the US ARMY'S USAV Major General Robert Smalls with its 13-foot draft, more than 10K kilometer range, and its 6000-ton displacement.

Then GOOGLE USMC "gator fleet."

This brings up an interesting potential situation. The ship is part of the General Frank S. Besson class and they started building them in 1987. There's only eight of them in service and I would argue that a major reason for that is because the collapse of the Soviet Union removed the need for a larger fleet.
So the potential situation is that without the "peace" from the end of the Cold War, more of the class could have been constructed.
Meaning that as a sourcebook/module writer or GM, you could expand the fleet and add a few of these ships where you needed them.

In a similar "what if", the Philippines Navy had two logistics support vessels built in the early 90s based on the Besson class with the most significant differences being a helicopter pad at the rear of the ship, a roof over part of the main deck and the ability to carry two LCVPs.
So for game purposes, it's not too far fetched to have the US Army also put that variant into service to compliment the Besson class. A helo/LCVP capable version would allow for certain operations that the conventional class wouldn't i.e. small team insertion by air/LCVP, wider range of SAR abilities and so on. There's no hangar but with the relatively calm oceans in the PNG area, transporting a helo on the pad wouldn't be so problematic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Frank_S._Besson-class_logistics_support_vessel

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacolod_City-class_logistics_support_vessel

[Legbreaker]

...the relatively calm oceans in the PNG area...

Hehe.
It's funny seeing people driving up to Darwin with surfboards on the roof to take advantage of the legendary huge surf up there!
Even funnier seeing their faces when they arrive and lay eyes on the MASSIVE 6 inch waves!

[Olefin]

Examples of how you could get US military personnel to Australia

US Marine detachment sent to help guard the Pine Gap facility - could easily see the US sending a couple of platoons given the importance of that facility and could have the US reinforce their embassy detachment in Canberra as well - or have detachments from other countries evacuated along with embassy personnel to Canberra

US logistics troops sent to Australia to assist shipments to South Korea and China from Australia - possibly with the US establishing depots for materials being transshipped there from the US

US military members of the Pine Gap facility (mostly communication/intelligence/signals personnel)

USN personnel from ships damaged by Soviet attacks that made port in Australia and that were never re-assigned or marooned by lack of fuel

USAF personnel supporting long range transport and cargo operations that were stranded in Australia due to lack of fuel

None of which would require a unit of any size to actually be located there either pre or post 1998

[StainlessSteelCynic]

Hehe.
It's funny seeing people driving up to Darwin with surfboards on the roof to take advantage of the legendary huge surf up there!
Even funnier seeing their faces when they arrive and lay eyes on the MASSIVE 6 inch waves!

Hahaha
Oh yes indeed! There's a reason the beaches on either the east coast or the west coast are rated as the best surfing spots in Australia. I recall a statement about surfing in the Northern Territory with it's "one or two months a year if you're lucky, waist high at best, waves and please keep an eye out for the saltwater crocodiles who are one of the stealthiest predators in the world", as being "unpleasant".

There's a reason why people have used small, open boats (like the 12ft dinghy) to nip back and forth between Far North Queensland and PNG and it's not simply because it's a (relatively) short distance.

[pmulcahy11b]

I have a blurb on the Australian Battle Rifles page, under the versions of the FN-FAL they had, about the "Brisbane Black Window," a good sniper who is merely a civilian Australian who has mad skills with her rifle. Anyone want to add this into the official record

[Legbreaker]

I have a blurb on the Australian Battle Rifles page, under the versions of the FN-FAL they had, about the "Brisbane Black Window," a good sniper who is merely a civilian Australian who has mad skills with her rifle. Anyone want to add this into the official record

See, that's exactly the sort of thing I want to include in the book!
Although I'm not sure she'd like being called a "window"...

[Olefin]

Examples of how you could get US military personnel to Australia

US Marine detachment sent to help guard the Pine Gap facility - could easily see the US sending a couple of platoons given the importance of that facility and could have the US reinforce their embassy detachment in Canberra as well - or have detachments from other countries evacuated along with embassy personnel to Canberra

US logistics troops sent to Australia to assist shipments to South Korea and China from Australia - possibly with the US establishing depots for materials being transshipped there from the US

US military members of the Pine Gap facility (mostly communication/intelligence/signals personnel)

USN personnel from ships damaged by Soviet attacks that made port in Australia and that were never re-assigned or marooned by lack of fuel

USAF personnel supporting long range transport and cargo operations that were stranded in Australia due to lack of fuel

None of which would require a unit of any size to actually be located there either pre or post 1998

FYI one very possible source for US characters could be USAR personnel that were originally deployed to support port operations in Australia to support US operations in the Gulf and Korea and then were cut off in Australia after the reduction in fuel supplies cut them off

they could be elements of a Transportation Terminal Battalion deployed to Australia in 1996-97 along with a couple of transportation companies to help with port operations - which would be a perfect addition for the sourcebook

[swaghauler]

This brings up an interesting potential situation. The ship is part of the General Frank S. Besson class and they started building them in 1987. There's only eight of them in service and I would argue that a major reason for that is because the collapse of the Soviet Union removed the need for a larger fleet.
So the potential situation is that without the "peace" from the end of the Cold War, more of the class could have been constructed.
Meaning that as a sourcebook/module writer or GM, you could expand the fleet and add a few of these ships where you needed them.

In a similar "what if", the Philippines Navy had two logistics support vessels built in the early 90s based on the Besson class with the most significant differences being a helicopter pad at the rear of the ship, a roof over part of the main deck and the ability to carry two LCVPs.
So for game purposes, it's not too far fetched to have the US Army also put that variant into service to compliment the Besson class. A helo/LCVP capable version would allow for certain operations that the conventional class wouldn't i.e. small team insertion by air/LCVP, wider range of SAR abilities and so on. There's no hangar but with the relatively calm oceans in the PNG area, transporting a helo on the pad wouldn't be so problematic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Frank_S._Besson-class_logistics_support_vessel

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacolo...support_vessel

Don't forget the Cyclone PCs! They were being used in the Philippines as well as the Gulf of Mexico for anti-piracy, drug enforcement, and general patrol. The Philippines was actually given USS Cyclone as a patrol ship.

This is something that is OFTEN overlooked when the LCS class ships are discussed. They were intentionally give "shoal-drafts" specifically for operating in this region because they replaced the OHP class Frigates (also having a shallow draft) that were also used in the shallow waters of the Asian Basin and the Persian Gulf where the much deeper drafted Burkes and Ticos could get into trouble trying to sail there.

[Legbreaker]

Some good stuff in here some of which can be translated into T2K and the Anzac book. https://youtu.be/rdaVTtuz3YM
It's followed by this one covering the post cold war period which I'm about to start watching now. https://youtu.be/VYI02dhyer8

[Legbreaker]

https://youtu.be/VYI02dhyer8[/url]

Ex Chief of Army. Very good, thought provoking presentation with the odd bit of humour thrown in. Has some interesting thoughts on China's recent expansion into the South China Sea and the US response.
Starts off with the question, why do we refer to the current time as the "post cold war period and what's a better name for it"